Hustle Hard vs. Hustle Healthy (Interview)

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Bobby Cappuccio

Bobby is an internationally recognized speaker and author, widely known for his dynamic and provocative style.

His reputation for providing individuals with the sciences, tools, information and inspiration to channel their aspirations into higher levels of achievement made Bobby Cappuccio one of the most sought after speakers in his industry.

You’ll want to check out his course ‘The Coaching Dynamics of Behaviour Change’ 


So the first thing I wanted to talk about was this concept of hustling hard versus hustling healthy and talk a little bit about the culture around hustling as hard as you can, working as hard as you can in the negative impacts of that on brain health. 

So it’s a good question. I’m glad you asked that because there seems to be a common trend and I think if you hear something with enough conviction, enough enthusiasm, and most importantly enough repetition, you stop questioning the source for the relevance, more importantly the relevance to you and you come to accept it as a belief. That’s just what it is. That’s how life occurs to you. And I think one of the drawbacks of social media and there’s a lot of benefits, but one of the drawbacks is so many people are competing for mindshare and you’re exposed to all of these messages, subsequential and and you’re exposed to these messages when your in the state of distraction, you’re exposed to these messages when you’re in a state of fatigue. So your normal filters that you have in conversation, somebody says something you evaluate, well, is that true?  You don’t have those same filters up and and a lot of these motivational memes are disguised as inspiration, but the accusation. So the first thing is when somebody says you shouldn’t be working, well you don’t even know who I am, but who’s reading this? Why would you assume that we are not? So you have to ask yourself, what’s the motivation of the person writing this meme? And usually a lot of people that write these means it’s a theme with them, like, I’m great and you suck. It’s always talking about what you should be doing that you’re not doing. Not that you’re not only not doing enough, but you yourself are not enough. And I’ll, I’ll, I’ll take another example. So my name that everybody knows Gary Vee. Yeah. When I first started listening to Gary Vee, I hated him. I was like, who is this absolute wineger?  Why are you yelling at me? And somebody said, well, you know, you should really read his stuff and then make a decision. I thought that’s a fair enough statement and I picked up one of multiple books I bought now crush it. I became an instant Gary v Fan before I was done reading the book because this is a guy who is a modern day, Tom Peters. Now, for those of you who don’t know who Tom Peters is, Tom Peters was a guy who worked for Mckinsey and he was the champion of work and career as a form of meaning life, and self expression and collaboration and his. His stuff was like walk. If it’s not, wow, why even do it when you pour your heart into something, a collaborative project that has meaning to multiple people. It’s a shared sense of vision. That’s what life is about. That’s what gives you meaning and sometimes doing excellent work is because while I do excellent work and someday I’ll wind up in a corner office, you know and have like my own private toilet, which is great and I can use a special coffee machine with like five people I can’t stand, but it’s about doing excellent work for its own sake because you got one career won’t go around Reading Caravan like this guy really wants people to succeed. This guy truly believes that people are living with Henry David thoreau called lives of quiet desperation and wants to shake out of that, so that’s a good intention, but there are other people behind the means that’s like, why are you saying so you’re trying to help me? Do you genuinely care about me? You care about this issue or is this just a way of saying, wow, you guys are doing so poorly over here. I guess I’m doing all right. Right. Which is insecurity. 

So you’re saying. Yeah,  quite a few things here. Let’s back up to the brain state that we’re in when we’re consuming things like social media, when we’re consuming these messages. Of Work Harder, be successful, that could eventually cause a less than optimal brain health. So one of the things you touched on is that we’re in a highly suggestible state when we are consuming these messengers. Is that correct? 

Yeah, I mean not all the time, but certain times. 

What does that state, what’s going on in the brain when we are in that state? And why is that having that effect? 

What we’re talking about here is distraction versus focused attention. So if I’m having a focus conversation with Ryan for example, right? Which, you know, if I’m crazy enough to actually engage in that, my brain can kind of filter what, what’s right and what’s not right? So there’s centers of the brain that pact as comparison meters, right? And I’m always comparing what I’m hearing from what I know to be true versus what I might not know to be true.  

So basically the center of the brain that would help us determine whether we’re filtering that or not would be the anterior cingulate gyrus.

And anterior cingulate gyrus, as you said earlier, reticular activating system. What we’re paying attention to. So the benefit of that is I can be more discerning, what I accept and what I don’t accept. I could evaluate information as it’s presented to them, but when I’m in a state of distraction or multitasking, right, or I’m really exhausted and I’m on my iphone like right before I go to bed, which is probably not the best time or right when you wake up. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. And we all do that. You know, I, I get yelled at by my wife. Luckily I just like wake up and like go to hit off on your alarm. She’s already like, are you faith? No, just woke up. I don’t even know. 

Regardless of the exposure to blue light at night, even if you’re wearing blue blocker glasses to protect yourself in the blue light, you’re still in that highly suggestible, relatively drained in terms of attentional resources state. And we’re taking these messages in addition to when we wake up. I think there’s an increase in Alpha wave activity in the brain, which makes us a little bit more suggestible. And so how can we regulate not just being away from our phones, but how can we have some internal mechanisms for regulating our suggestibility to those messages. I know that some of that subliminal, um, but can we kind of is, is there a way to create a value system that’s our foundation to protect ourselves from these messages? 

That is a beautiful question because one, here’s something that we were at a seminar, a seminar, right? Fitness business, sign it, there was something that he said from the stage at the sort of California, he said, I’m a producer of content, not a consumer of content. So before you go on facebook, ask yourself, why am I doing this? Like, why am I here? And it could be, it could be as simple as setting aside times of the day when you do go on social media because a lot of people enjoy being on social media. Um, and a lot of people need to be on social media for the nature of their work. So it’s not like let’s just get rid of social media that be exclusionary to that. Yeah, I got broke up with by a girl on the telephone when I was a kid. I just thought, well, I’m going to get rid of telephone because that must be the problem, but I’m only going to be on social media from 11 to 12 or let’s say seven and eight in the morning and five to 6:00 at night. So those are the two times that I’m going on social media. Why am I going on social media? What am I looking for? So maybe treat social media like a cocktail party. I’m not here to talk to everybody because some people I really don’t want to talk to. Some people I do want to talk to. I shouldn’t and I don’t have time to get around to the whole room. Who are the people that I most want to meet? Who Do I have the greatest point of commonality with? Assuming I’m somewhat socially awkward, I need that bridge a commonality. You can relate to that. Absolutely true cross. So now I have a specified time when I’m going on social media, I know why I’m going on social media. I know who I’m going to talk to on social media, so now I can concentrate and I keep it. If I’m going to read a post, what do I want to get out of this? Do I want to be dragged into a political argument? Do I want to get into a community that’s totally centered around cats? Um, what am I looking for? And now when I read a post, I can ask myself, what am I getting out of this? What can I contribute back to this group and what’s right about this? What’s wrong? Where do I agree? Where do I disagree? So utilizing to direct your mental focus to help you be a little bit more discerning. It’s kind of like reading a book through the filter of I’m just going to go front to back. I said, well, what was the book about? I don’t know, but I think I enjoy it. Versus here’s the questions I have for an author. I’m going to highlight what’s interesting. I’m her write down questions. I’m not going to read a book. I’m in a dialogue with a book. Talk about the reticular activating system. When you don’t know the answer to something and you say, well, I’ll find out, and then you go and you check it out and you come back and tell somebody, well, I looked it up and here’s the answer. You get the very same or similar question. Three years later you still remember it. That’s the power of focused attention. That’s the power of a dialogue. So you’re the one who taught me that because social media, a guy my age, it’s not intuitive. You’re like, treat it like you just out meeting people. 

Well, we can have these reflective questions that we can ask as a tool, but regardless of that we might still find ourselves just mindlessly scrolling while we’re on the toilet. It’s just inevitable. Right? And so another way we might be able to do this as look at the motor component of what we’re doing and what I mean by this is people with cigarette addictions, for example, are not just attracted to the cigarettes, is not just that dopamine hit or the neurochemical hit, whatever it is. It’s really the motor output associated with smoking the cigarette. So suggestive interpretations aside. We’re really looking at how can we disrupt the motor function? Let’s not go there. So one, one way of doing that is certainly putting your phone aside, maybe bricking your phone or just putting it aside in a cabinet or a drawer, but sometimes if we can do that because we usually have our phones with us, we might just say, I feel myself doing the movement. How can I disrupt the movement by either doing another movement or just stopping myself from doing the movement by asking myself a question, not just am I going on social media if I am, what am I looking for? What’s the result? But even just saying why am I doing this movement and practicing that meteoric impulse control and as we get deeper into the techniques behind what you’re doing, somatIQ meteoric not moronic, but meteoric . So your motor impulse, right? And so where we might experience poor meteoric impulse control is like if I go for a step in one direction, but really I step in a different direction when I stumble. That’s meteoric impulse control or lack thereof. But we have strategies for overcoming that. Um, now let’s talk about attentional resources. We talked about being suggestible. We talked about having a better value system.

One thing I want to bring up. It’s really important. And had a coaching client emailed me today and just basically say, well, you know, I’m doing these things and just, it’s just an extra five minutes a day. Does that count anywhere you start is a very good place to start. I don’t got to be great to get going on a certain behavior, but he got to get going. If you’re ever going to be great at it. Sure. So, you know, even five minutes a day it gives you a platform to build with and it gives you the confidence in my, um, my wife, uh, she basically, you know, not to contradict all the advice you gave of course that, but she, she was a walking and somebody left a cabinet open outside the building where the check and the meters and I think she had her head down, her phone got hit in that and she smashed her phone. So she, she didn’t have a phone for about a week and she adapted to it. Now obviously you don’t want to do that for your business, for your life. I’m not suggesting smash your phone, leave your phone at home all day. But what I am saying, there’s something to be said about disciplining yourself, engaging in certain tools versus reorganizing your life and your environment around your priorities. So if you go to the gym, I’ll give you a very clear example I can walk to and from my journey. As a matter of fact, there is no other reason why I joined the gym that I joined other than proximity and convenience. Right. So I know nothing is gonna happen. Like the car is not going to be stolen up. I could probably make it there and back. I mean how did we get through the eighties? Right? Those of you who even were alive in the eighties. I know I could leave my phone at home and when I get to a coffee shop because there’s one right on the corner of the gym, I make a stop and that’s where all do read my reading, you know, and that’s where I’ll start to get some ideas and highlight. A lot of times I want to check my phone but I can not engage in that because I just don’t have that resource available. And then if you could do that for like an hour or two a day, you can start to do that a little bit more deliberately. It’s, it’s almost like saying, oh, I promise at the end of my workday I’m going to go straight to the gym. Versus leaving yourself a physical cue, like your gym bag at the front door of your office so you’d have to trip over it and purposely leave it. They’re very different.

So having that physical or an environmental cue and not just think about being frustrated with ourselves or saying, oh, why am I looking at my phone? And being mad about it that I spent so much time on my phone, but actually using it as a reward system where, hey, at the end of this one hour to two hour time period, I can look at it again and so we’re kind of hacking that dopamine loop for our benefit. 

Yeah, and very important what Ryan just said is the self talk because if every time I look at my phone, it’s like an idiot girl. Never get this right. Yet you’re probably reinforcing the same emotional states that create your need for a dopamine hit in the first place so you’re not helping. You’re hurting. Better. Response kind of would be the laugh and just go, Oh wow, wow. Isn’t that interesting? Just like I’m on autopilot right now. The other thing, get off autopilot and put it away. There’s nothing wrong with you. Don’t take yourself that seriously in the first place. You’re not an idiot. Most of you. I mean that might be one. Either you’re watching this, but one or two, most of you are not idiots. You’re just conditioned just like everybody else. 

Exactly. So he came in when we talk about attentional resources, I’m going back to that because that was really good point on a few things on attentional resources is usually we’re most suggestible or more most prone to making these mistakes, if you will, while we’ve drained ourselves of our attentional resources or they’ve just been drained from our environment or activities. So would it be a sound strategy to then say, well, if my attentional resources are, say in eight out of 10, but I’m still suggestible, how can I make my attentional resources at 10 out of 10? What are the, some of the things that you find yourself in terms of health practices, uh, increasing your attentional resources day to day? Or. I think an easier way to think about this is when I don’t do x, my attentional resources are lower. What are those things for you? 

Okay. Just a couple of ways to answer this, so I’m not going to answer this in any given order. One emotional state. When you’re frustrated, when you’re angry, really bad, time to go onto social media. One, you want, you want to go on social media sometimes where you’re feeling good because we feel in good, you’ve got higher levels of Serotonin. Serotonin, the anterior cingulate cortex is intimately tied in with attention, right? Where attention goes, energy flows, right? Keep that in mind. Also, we talk about disciplining ourselves to do things. That’s another big meme, you know, work for it and you better be disciplined. Sure. But I, I sat down, um, I responded on someone’s strike a whole what is disciplined and they came back with a philosophical answer and it was wrong. But if I’m dealing with someone with like type one diabetes, I don’t need a philosophical response to why that pancreas is not producing insulin. I want to know like what actually happens if you’re talking about discipline, where does it live? Because it does look like, because if I’m talking about like cardio, respiratory health, my cardio respiratory system lives somewhere where is it live has function, and to me discipline is glucose regulated, sustained attention. That’s what it is beautifully and I probably could say that better if I wasn’t, you know, like depleted. Right now I’m knackered or if I had a chance to revisit this, but when you’re talking about discipline, you’re talking about the function, your prefrontal lobes and if you’re going to utilize it, it’s not free. It costs you currency and that currency is glucose. 

We call it cognitive calories. 

Calories is great way of saying that. I like that a lot. So if, if you’re, if you’re going on social media when you are hungry or just after you got out of a meeting where you had to utilize a lot of glucose to stay focused, to stay off your phone. So you were disciplined. Not a good time. So what’s your emotional state? What’s your level of fatigue and utilize questions always utilize, not always. That makes no sense. You can use utilize, utilize questions more frequently because what that does is it brings your prefrontal lobes back online. When you’re just going around on autopilot and you and you ask any question, you have to utilize your higher brain centers in order to get an answer for that question, so it’s a very good strategy to to direct your focus by not making statements, assumptions, and proclamations, but asking questions are a good resource for this is type into google or google scholar, a Abramson, a university of Illinois. You’ll come up with some cool research on that. 

Very cool. So when we’re on autopilot, right? Really what we’re finding ourselves in is the default mode network. You’ve heard of this and so when we’re in the default mode network, it’s that area of the brain that’s usually responsible for mind wandering, daydreaming, which is extremely valuable, but typically we find ourselves as victims of the default mode network and so there’s two places in my research where you can go. One is the executive network and the other is the task positive network and the executive network is this sustained attention state that we’ve been talking about and we can go there by using questions, having a acu, having a task to keep our attention planning organization and typically when people are trying to be productive, they’re trying to be in that executive network where they’re trying to do work which is associated with executive functions like attention planning, organization, working memory, emotional regulation, and so the executive network as the executive, the CEO of your brain, and so that’s where people are trying to go. I think that’s why people get frustrated when they catch themselves in the default mode network. They’re saying, crap, I really need to be in the executive network in order to accomplish my goals that my value systems aligned with, but we can also go to the task positive network. The TPN, which is usually activated when people are mindful. Now, you don’t have to just meditate. You can focus on your bodily sensations like your breath, what you’re feeling on your feet, what you’re taking in through your smell, your sight and your hearing and that can get you out of default mode and into task positive and so if you’re in default mode and you find that frustrating or not aligning to your value systems or what you need to do at the time, you can either direct your attention or directors sensation and when you kind of tweak your direction or your attention or your sensation, it can get you out of that default mode network until you’re ready or you need to come back to it and if we stay in executive network at all times, you can exhaust cognitive calories and you need to restore them usually by going to the task positive network by doing some sort of mindfulness or sensing the environment based activity or default mode network, which is kind of like your recovery state. 

Any faculty is a limited resource in the brain. 

Absolutely, and so knowing yourself and kind of knowing are we on this network, this network and this network really helps because if people catch themselves in the default mode network, they might think that there’s something psychologically wrong for them and we know what happens with the belief system. If people believe that, those symptoms can actually manifest and so what we want to do is use these…

Or engage in activities that prove you right and away from activities that threatened you because of that belief system. 

And that’s not necessarily that is the reticular activating system, right? And addressing it addresses those belief centers in the brain, but it’s not necessarily putting an intention out there and it comes true. It’s not a destiny based thing. It’s really a neuroscience thing. 

Right? You’re not altering cosmic events, but by virtue of your thought patterns, people, you’re not Franklin Richard rather, the real geeks understand what I just said.  A lot of people like to cite a carol dweck research and talk about fixed mindset versus growth mindset. And that’s something that’s become a buzzword. You want to have a growth mindset. What does that mean exactly? The way to success is just happening. You’re, you’re an achiever. No, that’s not what she was talking about. What she was talking about is the way people structure their belief systems based on the input they received. So characteristics. Research dealt with kids solving mathematical problems after receiving feedback or praise or coaching. That was very different. One was around the behaviors. The other one was coaching around in eight attributes like, wow, you really worked very hard on that, Ryan, that that shows a lot of commitment, very proud of you versus you’re so smart. And obviously for those of you who know the research, you know where we’re going. Those don’t very simply. The kids who are constantly told, you’re so great, you’re so smart. They get screwed up big time because both of those kids were given equally challenging mathematical problems and the kids who were told how smart they were performed not only not as well, but they quit sooner because if I run into a hard problem, I can’t solve it and my identity and self worth a structure on being smart. Right? Well now if I can’t do this, what am I vs of m praised and condition as the behavior itself? That’s a virtue. Well, if I want it to something difficult, this is a great time to exercise my virtue rather than having my virtue or my identity threatened, which puts me in a state of fight or flight, which is not good either. Avoiding something right or combating it, becoming antagonistic, freezing, doing nothing at all. So when we talk about fixed mindsets versus a growth mindset, that’s exactly what we’re talking about. 

Well, how often do people or even us try to seek those innate values tend to be reflected in us from other people saying, Oh, I want you to tell me I’m xyz versus that I just work really hard. Right? 

Whereas your worst thing is to is to get too attached to other people’s opinion or your own headlines about who you are and you’re not very objective and how to evaluate yourself, neither other people. That shit doesn’t define you. What do you do based on what you love? That’s a more powerful metric and that’s one of the camp he threatened. 

Which is why I love Simon Sinek work with find your wide because it’s. What’s that statement you can anchor to that then determined your behaviors and the steps you take, but the why statements not you focused. It’s focused outside of you, which is great because it’s really promoting the work and the behaviors, not necessarily the innate values because if we looked at apes and we took a group of 10 apes, right, and we said these gorillas are going to put out behaviors that either contributed to their survival as a group or do not, and if half of those apes are probably thinking, well, I’m the best. I’m the strongest. I’m the best hunter. I’m the best person that reproducing whatever it is. African you, Eric and apes. What are you doing right, but they’re all apes and basically they need to put out behaviors that contribute to their survival or do not, but those behaviors are a result of their work, not a result of who they are. 

Yeah, and usually outwardly focused because we were the weakest and Slovis normal on the African, so that. But that’s, that’s neither here nor there. Even when you’re as big and strong as an ape, the only way you survive is by helping others. Collaboration, I mean with a less evolved brain that doesn’t work out very well. You’re better off being fast or strong or some combination of both, but when you have a more highly evolved brain, one of the reasons for that is around collaboration. If I was like, you know, 40,000 years ago being attacked by a woolly mammoth, I’m not very formidable. However, if I can communicate with five of my tribes, people confuse that woolly mammoth or get it to avoid me and go over a cliff. I’m extremely formidable. So I’m thinking about Robertson Sapolsky have. Have you ever come across any information from brokers? Have asked about his work and his observation of baboon troops. Sure. Fuck, do we have time for a funny story? Not Funny. It’s actually tragic, but I’m twisted. So they were studying because this, this comes back to the whole work for it versus you know, exercitation versus contribution. So they were studying alpha males versus Beta males in this baboon troop and what they found was that the Betas had a much higher incidence of what we would call stress related and lifestyle related illnesses. And you would because you’re always afraid, you’re always subjugated, you have probably have less opportunity to mate. So all of the [inaudible] of the, the, the struggles that you find in modern human life, very simple struggles were found here, but something very interesting happen. There was a group of tourists who were told that where they were staying, don’t leave any food out and don’t leave it behind for your own safety. And also for maintenance of the ecology. Now, if you’ve worked at in the gym business long enough, you know what people are told they should do is not always what they actually do. 

Common sense versus common practice. 

People leave their weights out when they know they really shouldn’t. The people left their food behind and all the food got tainted and the baboon troop stumbled across this like free food while it’s like Christmas, like okay, my early this year, but here’s the problem. Only the outthis, which not a true sense of the term Alpha, but that’s a whole different story. Got to eat first because they weren’t in charge and nobody challenged him. Unfortunately for them the food was so tainted. They all died. Wow. So now you had a droop whole. All the outfits dead. So now you have females and Beta males together. What’s going to happen to this troop? Well, what they found is when they retested all of the. When they took the blood work of all of these Beta baboons, they had better health lockers and when followed long term, they were more healthy in the absence of the Alphas. Then the Alphas war in comparison to them and in every single category, the truck or the truth, not the tribe flourished because here you had the Alphas subjugating the tribe. Now everybody was like these, they were nice guys for the most part and they were helping them, women and the women that the females in turn, we’re helping the band of males and they all work together and in every sense of the word of the tribe flourished and and all of the, could you call it baboons into all the baboons inside that tribe did better in comparison. 

So what does that mean for us? 

What it means for us is I think an outward focus, which started me on this tangent, is you talked about outward focus and we’re so conditioned that when you’re doing without look within at one of the best ceos I’ve ever worked with, or at least one of the one that I respected a lot, talked about the concept of originating intention and what makes an originating intention. Power always truly believed, but he kinda gave a succinct phrase to it is it starts with the word view and it’s focused outward on somebody else and what you want to contribute. Which I think is a great litmus test for how you direct your attention daily. Because you don’t have to tell a great dad or a great mom to focus on their kid. Like I was reading an article where, um, somebody had advised just so you don’t leave your kid in the backseat of your car. Leave something valuable back there as well, like your phone, like your phone, something valuable versus your kid. You’re living, breathing. What do you, what does our society mental, but you don’t have to tell good parents out because it’s not going to leave their kid in the back of a hot car because they value the kid over the phone. You’re not going to tell them all, you got to feed your kid. They’re going to feed the kid. If you ever took a look at it, like pick their whole life revolves around that kid. Why? Because the meaning that kid represents and the outward focus and so they’re not going, hey, you know what? I’m going to work on my ability to be a better parent. Well, okay. Meanwhile you’re like your kid. It’s, it’s all of those attributes that make great parenting. They don’t show up perfectly, but they show up automatically as a result of having the intention of loving that kid and wanting to do what’s best for that kid, so when outward versus inward focus, a lot of times, one, it alleviates all of the emotional states that compare focus and that impair performance. I can’t be 100 percent focused on coaching Ryan and Ryan is the center of my attention in the moment and still be self conscious, still feel anxiety, right? Still feel anger, still feel depressed. I can’t feel all of that in this moment to the same degree if I’m outwardly focused right now. 

Right, and so the way we can apply this as as many ways to go back to the baboons and Alpha male study, right? If we are concerned with being the Alpha male, that’s probably not healthy and it kind of brings us full circle to the hustle, healthy versus hustle hard, right? Where everyone’s trying to be the Alpha male in whatever space it is, and that’s vitally important to them, but according to that study, it’s not necessarily healthy to do that. In addition, we want to focus out and so oftentimes we want to focus out on others and that’s a great leadership strategy, but as a health strategy, what if we were to take our components of ourselves like our health and say, if my health was my baby, I would focus on my health and refer to my health as almost like this, not to make it artificially schizophrenia, but say this health is my baby.  I’m going to focus out on my health and maybe that’s a good mental strategy to reframe or efforts towards the things that matter and so if we identify the top three things that matter, let’s say our health, our support system, but both the combination of family work and friends and maybe our higher purpose, which is usually focused on other people. Maybe your why statement and we have three babies now and we’re focusing out on those babies daily. That would be one, a great way to focus our attention, to eliminate distractions because we’re focusing our attention in three. Be able to be healthy in alignment to our value system and therefore be happier. Is that a fair way to lay that out?

That’s a beautiful way to lay it out. One of my very best friends in the world, he just lost his dad over the past couple of days and one of the things he was saying about his. I met his dad will lovely guy and one of the things that he was he was saying is that his dad gave him unconditional love and his dad was his hero and you know, he, his dad again didn’t set out and say I’m going to be the world’s greatest dad. Cause not a good strategy for anything because you’re likely to develop blind spots if it’s all about view versus the object of how you live out your values. And he said he bit. His Dad was a hero because he sacrificed so much because he wanted his kids to take risks and have that security financially and emotionally to know. Okay, you always have the love of your family to fall back on because what he valued was people taking risks. What you valued was adventure, you know, exploration. And it’s funny how you know his, his son has a lot of that and he said, man, if I, if I don’t use my life to my fullest ability, shame on me for taking all my dad’s sacrifices and vain. I think, you know, we talk about behaviors usually line up with values. If you look at how someone behaves, see I hate that shit where? Well it behavioral flacked like character and you lack this and people are not broken. I don’t hold that perspective. There’s nothing wrong with you. There is nothing wrong with you. You just might have a value system that you don’t think you should have because somebody told you that’s not okay. You want to be like us. And most people have heard his called wants to take a look at what 99 percent of the people in the world are doing. Do the opposite because you’re don’t want to go in that direction. Not saying 99 percent of the people are wrong in the wrong direction. But are they living true themselves? If you want to know what you value, ask yourself, okay. If you won the lottery and like hundreds of millions and time and money were no longer a factor in your life, what would you do with your time? What would you learn? Right? Who would you hang out with? Who would you never see you again? And that starts to reflect a lot of your values. You know, like, like you’re Ryan talked about family being a value on health, being a value that’s an environmental construct that allows you to live your values. Here’s what I mean, because I value my family. I know a lot of times I’ll say to audiences, no you don’t. And people look at me like, like I just said that their religion was false. Understand what I mean? Especially if you’re someone who said, well, I want to have a family one day, and then you had family. The value was there in the first place because otherwise you wouldn’t have wanted that family. You might value luck, right? Or you might value like my friend’s dad freedom. Yeah, exploration and you want to help this kid. You have an environment where you can now teach that and you can now give that and if loves your highest value, you can create that within the network 

And so the family and that example becomes the vessel. So, typically people are surrounded by these general already surrounded by family and some contacts, right? We’re a support system, friends, a work environment that everyone has one of those, right. And typically people are in this physical vessel so they have their health or they have a vessel that they can focus on and then people have their mental vessel, the brain based vessel where they can focus on their beliefs, their work, their mental outputs. They’re mental inputs. And so what are three easy steps people can take to find the values that occupy any of those festivals. 

Oh, okay. So what you’re asking is how do you take a look at the things that you’re doing in your life, your family work? Sure. Yeah. And so what are the values that go into each drive? Okay. Really good question. Not An easy one, but a really important one when you’re in your day to day stuff, I’m just going to take one. Alright. Um, because because to, to evaluate through it will be harder. Let’s say mark is work is fair. What activities in your work day do you have to discipline yourself to do and push yourself to do would be a better word versus which ones pull you into them by the sheer nature of how you feel. That’s number one. Number two, what are the areas of this goes back to Dr. Viktor Frankl and logotherapy. What are the areas in your life where you take something that other people find hard to learn and you learn it will be easily compared to other people you know. Um, where are your, where are your greatest areas of competence and where’s your greatest areas of interest? And then look at the other side of that. What are things you have to push yourself to do? What are activities where it’s the hardest for you to maintain focus and attention most of the time? Does the same things constantly come up, right? Um, W, w when you, when you stay late at the office, right? Or wake up early and you’re excited about that, what are those activities and what are those have in common? What do they represent? They represent that. Yeah, that better way of saying that because a lot of times our interest and our enjoyment and our ability to get really good at something is rooted in what we value. Got It. At that. And we learned this, we, we, we kind of know this when were a kid and you know, the great example, typical example is the guy who grows up to me in the journey, but when he was in school he couldn’t stop himself from picking up instruments, you know, and he’s dad maybe when he was law school. So you need to study harder and you have to force themselves to study where he’d be up all night till like 12 one in the morning trying to practice on an instrument. What will is the personable easy. That’s why he’s not studying the law. How could you be so lazy at law but practicing music, you’re so committed and a lot of people are attempted to say, well, because music’s easy really goes through the same. You have to go through the same hard intense rigor and push past fatigue. Notice mistakes go back deliberately correct them. They’re equally as hard and deep practice necessary for exact deep practice necessary for the Myelin causation that allows you to develop capacity or scale achieved mastery. If you x, yes, and other people like the music was enjoyable, why is that wrong? It’s almost like, well, if you love what you do, you’re doing it wrong. No. If you love what you do, you’ll have that mental reserve. 

And it’s more energy efficient talking what you love, right, and that’s a great way to maximize attentional resources, maximize the cognitive calories you’re spending it. Really kind of remove any of those mental, psychological, or even cognitive as is that people get because they’re not enacting in terms of their value system or along their values, and I think that’s wonderful because a lot of people wonder why they’re foggy, fatigue, anxious, depressed. Typically it’s not. It’s because they’re not enacting their value system or along with their value system. I think this is a great mental tool for people to have that they can kind of answer their own questions and this step by step to kind of achieve that as a, as a mental health and cognitive health tool. So that’s great. Thank you. 

Thanks Ryan.